NZFF

Just spotted this lovely little sim on TradeMe

http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=313102347

Sorry if someone may have already posted it...

omitchell wrote:

QUOTE (omitchell @ Aug 25 2010, 05:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry if someone may have already posted it...

I hadn't seen it......... and I sure wouldn't have thought it would carry that sort of price tag!!!

I know, can buy several real planes for that lol

mfraser wrote:

QUOTE (mfraser @ Aug 25 2010, 05:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I hadn't seen it......... and I sure wouldn't have thought it would carry that sort of price tag!!!

I'd heard that these things were expensive - which is why they could only be "supported" in major population centres. They are very good (and far cheaper than sims created by some of the "big companies" out there), but of course one wuld either need 2 be v well-heeled to own one privately, or have a business idea to run it, or need it for airline training (which apparently these are certified for).

Do you think it runs RealNZ? lol

omitchell wrote:

QUOTE (omitchell @ Aug 25 2010, 05:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you think it runs RealNZ? lol

I had a free go on the Hamilton sim......... one of the few perks of being an Air Traffic Controller!! I was told that theirs ran FS9!! I flew in and out of Queenstown a couple of times and I recognised the freeware NZQN scenery.........

mfraser wrote:

QUOTE (mfraser @ Aug 25 2010, 05:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I was told that theirs ran FS9!!

Yes, last I heard they were still running FS9. When one has so much stuff hard-wired as in a sim like this, changing to FSX is most certainly not an easy proposition...

I would not be paying that sort of money!

It is only worth half that.. maybe less. The last franchise sold for 550K business and all.. so why the hell are they trying to get that sort of money. I can buy them from Canada for FS9 or FSX imported and sell on with a profit built for 365K and then add 120K for full motion. These are as good and in some way better than the Pac sims.

Oh well.. if you got money to throw away then go for it.

vatsim-aholic wrote:

QUOTE (vatsim-aholic @ Aug 25 2010, 07:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can buy them from Canada for FS9 or FSX imported and sell on with a profit built for 365K and then add 120K for full motion. These are as good and in some way better than the Pac sims.

I promise to look you up if I win Powerball this weekend.........

vatsim-aholic wrote:

QUOTE (vatsim-aholic @ Aug 25 2010, 07:45 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I can buy them from Canada for FS9 or FSX imported and sell on with a profit built for 365K and then add 120K for full motion.

Perhaps you might have a market here then? I remember reading about the NZ ones when they came out, and word had it that there was nothing that could come close to them at the time. Do you think it's a case of technology having passed them by and them trying to flog them on? Also, the dollars you are mentioning - are they Canadian or NZ dollars? I'm just interested in the comparison and to hear that poss these NZ ones might be v over-priced. Not that I have $700k+ to burn... Or even $365k!

omitchell wrote:

QUOTE (omitchell @ Aug 25 2010, 05:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you think it runs RealNZ? lol

I believe they do actually run FS2004 with a 'special' RealNZ customised for them (for Wellington at least). Comment Robyn?

I had a 'fly' on the one in Wellington (which is no longer) and it's all about the cockpit hardware an controls which is very real indeed - but from a graphics POV I much preferred the FSX RealNZ experience I get at home!

It does seem very expensive though for a sim without motion

IslandBoy77 wrote:

QUOTE (IslandBoy77 @ Aug 25 2010, 07:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes, last I heard they were still running FS9. When one has so much stuff hard-wired as in a sim like this, changing to FSX is most certainly not an easy proposition...

Actually... it only took a couple of hours to get it up and running FSX. As for getting it stable enough to be running FSX in a Flight Experience franchise, that didn't happen in my time with them. FSX ran really well otherwise on the new sims. A sim like Wellington had and Hamilton has might struggle to run it though. The sim is programmed with in-house software that communicate to the environment the sim is flying in. There isn't a great deal required of the sim world as so much is happening via the cockpit software.
Yes, they had Real NZ from Robin in the sims. I don't know what kind of deal they worked with him, that's their business.....
This sim is extremely well priced when you consider the other professional options out there. Flight Deck solutions in Canada I learnt to not be at all reliable after the Pac Sim dealings with them. This sim is very tidy, well maintained and a reliable one. I don't believe they lose much of their value when it's as good today as the day it was first made. The sim is not like a car that will die after 200,000km. This will do 2 million kilometres and still be good. And upgradable, and broken parts can be replaced with new etc.. So it holds it's value.

Anyway... that's just my 2 cents from someone who used to be in that game, and believed in what he was doing.

In my time there was one private owner of a FE type sim and he did already own a real helicopter of his own so I guess he could justify spending that kind of money on a simulator

PS you don't NEED motion to make it a believeable experience. Sure the big ones have it, but even simulation industry experts are questioning the relevance of it for cockpit flight training.

Albatross wrote:

QUOTE (Albatross @ Aug 25 2010, 09:49 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually... it only took a couple of hours to get it up and running FSX.

Interesting. So your saying that a specially-developed in-house bit of software handles all the physical controls, and then is able to be easily mapped through to FSX? I had visions of some poor bloke having to re-do the assignment of every knob and switch!

I think your right. After all in any training sim in the world, it's still a flight sim. And be it boeing or airblob they sell them for millions to airlines.

The hardware and software setup in this sim is incredible (having been in in the Auckland one) tho I still don't think worth 750k. But having said that, definatly the best FS product ever to hit Trademe

haha I agree with that Owen.
Yes, there are numerous levels of in house software controlling the sim. You wouldn't believe how many times I have heard people say that it is simply PMDG linked up to switches lol. It's far from it. Every switch did need to be mapped correctly to the software, but the smart computer coding guys built all sorts of cool programs to make that job a little easier So once the button was assigned correctly between the software and the hardware, it was good to go. Be it FS9 or FSX, the sim stands alone from flightsim for the most part. (my lay man understanding since I wasn't one of the computer programmers!)
There are so many levels of 'awesome' behind this sim that the passengers don't see, plus in terms of development costs, and hardware costs, (the throttle section alone is worth as much as a new Holden Commodore!) I can see how they want that sort of money for it.
I will agree with you that there can't be that many eligible buyers out there, it is a lot of cash to part with. On top of that cost will be the cost of moving it somewhere else in the world, and that won't be cheap either

Ummm Holdens are cheap, Go FPV!!! (Sorry couldn't resist)

Albatross wrote:

QUOTE (Albatross @ Aug 25 2010, 10:23 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

(the throttle section alone is worth as much as a new Holden Commodore!)

(coming from a Ford man myself)
Slightly more than an FPV then! Ford are better value for money

Ford man? Ok I like this guy

Yes the one I work on here has Real NZ Tauranga and Rotorua and the Red Baron Mesh and runs on FS9, I think reason for running FS9 as if it we wanted to put FSX on it it, it would take so much time and effort to get all the systems and drivers upgraded and running correctly as each button and dial is programed to reconise in flight sim (as I was told and sorta figured to me) and I guess it's not really worth the labour and money just for some better graphics, sure I would like to see our sim running FSX but I guess from a financial point of view it's not worth it :S ?

We do have a fair bit of addon scenery though to make the graphics looks good such as the freeware scenery for NZQN, NZNP and Fly Tamp Kai Tak in Hong Kong and a few other areas...Robin would be good if we had your Real NZ Wellington which we don't have

I did once think about bringing in some freeware scnery made from our forum members and installing it however when we boot the system is runs from a default start up server from Christchurch I believe..

Anyway back to the auction..yea expensive BIG TIME!! though they are more to it then you actually think, the systems such as the throttles are really expensive as someone brought up earlier ^^ and if you think about all the buttons and systems running the thing plus the labour in building and installing the sim itself, I would say the price matches up to the amount of work put into it..

It is a shame to see so many other Flight Experience Franchises closing down (ression has played a big part I believe, as to most companies) though most of them are away from Airports which I beleive would be an advantage like our store here at TG aerodrome..

So yes it's expensive to use however if you think about all the man hours gone into it, you can hopefully understand!!

They also cost alot to maintain and service, everytime the guys from Pacific Simulations come up (they made these sims) it costs a fair bit and when you have a fair amount of people using the sim, things do break down and knobs and dials fall off, these are more expensive than you think to replace..

And people say this to me alot, "shame it dosen't move"..It's realistic enough without having to move, we can log IF time in our logbooks and is certified by the CAA for certain hours used for instrument ratings and currencys.. plus the amount of things you can do in the sim, you will be quite surprised!
Anyway I don't mean to blab on or sound like people don't understand the costs involved, not my intention at all , just thought I would explain from a staff members point of view.

Regards

Chris

Believe me, no one is questioning the cost involved, nor the quality, but 750k seems excessive. Nice to see tho we have members who have first hand knowledge with these systems.