Airline Pilot?

[Kelburn]

If this has been covered before feel free to close this thread.

But is anyone here an actual Airline Pilot?
If they are I'd be interested to know how they got to be a pilot and what they fly (considering I'm a budding airline pilot)

[jastheace]

Hi,

i am not a pilot, but my friend is, here is how he became a pilot He joined the RNZAF ATC (air training Corp) when he was about 13, he did his training and PPL through that. he then built up hours at the local club flying cessnas and the like. he then did his commercial pilots license at great expense to himself (had well off perents how picked up most of it) he said the hardest part for him was getting a job, he started out in some of the smaller airlines (sun air and the likes) buildiing up hours, he then got a job at MT cook flying ATR-72's. he has just left the country to go and fly for a UAE airline (didn't say which one) but he did tell me that he will be flying A320's and A330's to start of as a captain, he also said that he was not going to get to fly the jets etc in NZ as in his words, it was a closed club and that only the older guys got on the jets, and only if you were liked by the cheif pilots. he wasn't as he blew up a 737 captain and reported the near miss to CAA, but that is another story.
he did say that it was so much easier to get started in the UAE than anywhere else, as they cannot get pilots, and that they are really good payers too

hope that helps a little

Jason

[2fst4u]

QUOTE (jastheace @ Dec 16 2007, 12:36 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi,

i am not a pilot, but my friend is, here is how he became a pilot He joined the RNZAF ATC (air training Corp) when he was about 13, he did his training and PPL through that. he then built up hours at the local club flying cessnas and the like. he then did his commercial pilots license at great expense to himself (had well off perents how picked up most of it) he said the hardest part for him was getting a job, he started out in some of the smaller airlines (sun air and the likes) buildiing up hours, he then got a job at MT cook flying ATR-72's. he has just left the country to go and fly for a UAE airline (didn't say which one) but he did tell me that he will be flying A320's and A330's to start of as a captain, he also said that he was not going to get to fly the jets etc in NZ as in his words, it was a closed club and that only the older guys got on the jets, and only if you were liked by the cheif pilots. he wasn't as he blew up a 737 captain and reported the near miss to CAA, but that is another story.
he did say that it was so much easier to get started in the UAE than anywhere else, as they cannot get pilots, and that they are really good payers too

hope that helps a little

Jason

just to be clear, ATC has no affiliation with RNZAF. im a corporal in ATC no1 sqn (welly). we just wear their uniform and get to go on bases

[jastheace]

QUOTE (2fst4u @ Dec 21 2007, 07:47 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

just to be clear, ATC has no affiliation with RNZAF. im a corporal in ATC no1 sqn (welly). we just wear their uniform and get to go on bases

i always knew it as the RNZAF ATC, but then that was how my grandfather explained it to me, mind you that was almost 20 years ago now. sorry about that

[Kelburn]

my friends are in it but they don't fly very often from what I hear.

My route path was to get my PPL, CPL and a couple of necessary ratings and then move onto a small airline (e.g. sounds air - just an example) and hopefully go to the Air NZ Beechcrafts. I was also seriously considering going ovverseas ater on because my basic life ambition is to become a 737 Captain and I'm not too sure if that'd be very possible in New Zealand.

[benwynn]

You will need a bit more than that Kelburn. Most Airlines dont want you unless you have the F ATPL. That way once you have the hours and age, you have a ATPL. I can almost Guarentee you wont go straight from a CPL with almost no experience to Sounds Air or Similar.If you dont go with any sort of Cadetship or similar, you can expect to be flying Regionals or Instructing for a few years atleast to gain hours.

Myself Kelburn- I am planning to do Qantas Cadets. The course isnt cheap, around $80K AUD, but it can be paid by HECS- The Government Loan Scheme for University. There are a 2 Courses- a 3 Year and an 18 Month. Both Courses qualify you with a Frozen ATPL. The 18 month course is an Assosiate Degree, and the 3 year a Bachelor Degree.

After the course is finnished and you pass, Qantas selects employment for you for another 2 years. This can be anything of there Choice- You dont get to choose- It could be Qantas Link, or it could be flying Regionals in Darwin. After this period of 2 years, Guarenteed Job with Qantas as a Second Officer on the Boeing 747-400 or Similar at a later time. They dont say they guarentee the job, but if you pass, it is guarenteed from what I have herd. Perhaps you could give this a shot Kelburn?

QUOTE

He did say that it was so much easier to get started in the UAE than anywhere else, as they cannot get pilots, and that they are really good payers too
hope that helps a little
Jason[/quote]


Not Totally True. Emirates 777 FO only get around $100000 PA including Housing, Education, Utilities etc Allowance. Which, isnt a great deal, and you have to Live in Dubai....But, thats Emirates- Etihad is offering 777 First Officer positions, with a Similar Salary, but much much less hours needed. Only around 1500 Minimum, though atleast 1000 of that has to be ATP Operations. Which Obiously means you would want to have around 2000hours atleast.

Last edited by benwynn on Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

[benwynn]

QUOTE (benwynn @ Dec 17 2007, 09:30 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Myself Kelburn- I am planning to do Qantas Cadets. The course isnt cheap, around $80K AUD, but it can be paid by HECS- The Government Loan Scheme for University. There are a 2 Courses- a 3 Year and an 18 Month. Both Courses qualify you with a Frozen ATPL. The 18 month course is an Assosiate Degree, and the 3 year a Bachelor Degree.

I hope you are an Australian citizen then.... as this page says:

QUOTE

Is financial assistance available?

It is expected that any Australian citizen admitted into the Qantas Cadet Program and Bachelor of Technology will be eligible for HECS-HELP assistance with the Student Contribution Amount payable for each University unit of study. Australian Permanent Residents and New Zealand citizens are not eligible for HECS-HELP. Flight Training Fees paid direct to the Flight Training Organisation (FTO) will not be funded through HECS-HELP.[/quote]

Also note that the fees paid to the FTO are not eligible for HECS funding... they are being estimated for 2008 as:

QUOTE

All students enrolled in this program pay the Flight Training Fees directly to the FTO. 2008 Cadets should expect to pay at least $75,000 for the flight training component.[/quote]

So even if you are an AU citizen, you cannot get HECS funding for the flying... although apparently QF will loan you the money through some line of credit scheme of theirs...??? but that is only up to AU$60k...

I'd start saving now if I were you!

Last edited by HardCorePawn on Mon Dec 17, 2007 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

HardCorePawn

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[benwynn]

HCP,

Yes, I am dual Citizen Australian and New Zealand. Lucky!

Thanks for the Info HCP- Yes, I do belive Qantas Credit Union handles the loans. They are fairly low interest so I should be OK if it works out how I plan it!


Ben

[2fst4u]

QUOTE (jastheace @ Dec 16 2007, 09:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

i always knew it as the RNZAF ATC, but then that was how my grandfather explained it to me, mind you that was almost 20 years ago now. sorry about that

well, if it was your grandad then it may have been affiliated with the air force back then. i could check but im too lazy

[Kelburn]

if there is an applicable cadetship, I'd go for that.
I was thinking about the QANTAS one but I didn't know any info about it.

Any airline Cadetship info would be appreciated.

I do admit that I made my plan sound quick and easy, I didn't mean it that way.

[benwynn]

QUOTE (Kelburn @ Dec 17 2007, 08:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

my basic life ambition is to become a 737 Captain and I'm not too sure if that'd be very possible in New Zealand.

Ahhh why does everyone just think of Glorious ol Air NZ..?? (I would never work for em, will be well overseas before I have to deal with those monkeys, but different strokes for different folkes I guess) Yes in Air NZ it takes bloody ages to get a command BUT remember we have two other airline 73 operators here both of which are screaming out for pilots and captains and both of which almost have the fastest progression times to command in the southern hemisphere !!! Last heard It was 2-3 years as an FO also heard that pac blue reciently upgraded an FO to command after 18 months...

QUOTE

Most Airlines dont want you unless you have the F ATPL. That way once you have the hours and age, you have a ATPL.[/quote]

I have said it once before on here but I will say it again: THERE AIN'T NO SUCH THING AS AN FATPL IN NZ !!! Here you have to sit subjects and they are valid for 10 years with the exception of air law which is 5 and once you have the reqs you have to sit a massive flight test in an advanced aircraft over 5700kg (some exceptions) just like a CPL only heaps harder.

Should be an FATPL system in this country though, like most others. The caa here are morons

QUOTE

I can almost Guarentee you wont go straight from a CPL with almost no experience to Sounds Air or Similar[/quote]

I know quite a few guys who have gone straight to soundsair in particular. They usually start you off on the meatbombing for a few months then to the airvan then caravan etc. The pprob with them though is they ain't got no twins so it hard to get an airline job from there, however Vincent take alot of their guys on the 1900 from soundsair..

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[benwynn]

QUOTE

BUT remember we have two other airline 73 operators here both of which are screaming out for pilots and captains and both of which almost have the fastest progression times to command in the southern hemisphere !!! Last heard It was 2-3 years as an FO also heard that pac blue reciently upgraded an FO to command after 18 months...[/quote]

Which airlines are these?

Also I was thinking of going from a small airline like Soundsair to a 1900d operator (another a/c I'd enjoy flying) - Air Eagle doesn't have too high requirements and doesn't look like alcatraz to get a job in. But I heard it's good to start with Vincent and then maybe progress to Air Eagle

QUOTE

meatbombing[/quote]
What does that mean?

Kelburn

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[benwynn]

QUOTE

meatbombing[/quote]

QUOTE

What does that mean?[/quote]

Parachuting

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[A185F]

QUOTE (Kelburn @ Dec 17 2007, 07:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Which airlines are these?

Also I was thinking of going from a small airline like Soundsair to a 1900d operator (another a/c I'd enjoy flying) - Air Eagle doesn't have too high requirements and doesn't look like alcatraz to get a job in. But I heard it's good to start with Vincent and then maybe progress to Air Eagle

Hmm well the 73 operators I mean are Qantas NZ (jetconnect) based in chch and Pacific Blue also based in chch. Very few people go from soundsair to eagle (does happen though) but eagle IS ALCATRAZ to get into, one of the hardest around, up there with cathay pacific and the likes,- no kidding. One doesn't usualy go from vincent to eagle (has happened the other way around a few times though), both are entry level on 1900s. Most guys usually go from vincent to mt cook, air nz, jetconnect, pac blue and quite a few to Cathay as SOs. Oh and you do know it is "Eagle Airways" parth of air nz link right...? As opposed to "Air Eagle"....

Meat bombing is the slang type term used to discribe skydiving operations i.e the dropping bombs of meat and the meat being the people getting out !! Soundsair provide pilots and aircraft for Skydive the sounds. They pay their meat bombing pilots penuts I think,- no wait, less than penuts

[Kelburn]

any flying for me is good.
What should I do.
Next year I will start flying more frequentl for my PPL and after I get that I will carry on to get a CPL.
What should I do from there?
Note - i won't go through the airforce

[FunkymonkeyNZ]

QUOTE (Kelburn @ Dec 17 2007, 09:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

any flying for me is good.
What should I do.
Next year I will start flying more frequentl for my PPL and after I get that I will carry on to get a CPL.
What should I do from there?
Note - i won't go through the airforce

Hey dude thought i'd reply on your post, look to be totally honest not one of us here can plan out and organise where we will go after collage or if your doing it step by step, thats just plain out dumb mate. i myself have no idea what im going to do or where i going to go once im finished with my CPL, maybe someone has a slot for you to fall right into once u finish your studies but 9/10 most have to ruff it. why fly in NZ so bad man? look China needs another 50,000 pilots in the next 10years, Saudi and those areas are screaming for more pilots to meet the demands of up ad coming aviation future! there are endless possabilitys to where our courier takes us, but if you want to stay in NZ then i take my hat off ya mate because we are such a small country and such small ammount of aviation companys that can offer you a position to train at early ages (age30 and below) So mate just chill about your future ok, its all good! if u have the passion and determination to keep on keeping on then go get em!!!

[A185F]

QUOTE (Kelburn @ Dec 17 2007, 09:20 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

any flying for me is good.
What should I do.
Next year I will start flying more frequentl for my PPL and after I get that I will carry on to get a CPL.
What should I do from there?
Note - i won't go through the airforce

Just do that !! Fly !

Where are you going to learn to fly ?

[Kelburn]

thanks for that.
I do think overseas is looking probable.

E.g. a few years ago the U.K. was getting a shortage of pilots.
same with Australia (both according to 3 News).

Although I think i'll rule out Saudi Arabia and Iraq etc.

My parents would have heart attacks if I said:

"Hey mum and dad I'm going to fly old Russian antonovs in the middle east where George Bush is try to keep peace in war he started!"

(We'll I'll admit they don't only fly antonovs; and lets leave politics out of this thread)
And for where I'll fly.
Dunno Welly Flight Centre (gotta love it as they don't do it for the money but to teach folks to fly) maybe with my dads friend (or both and that way I can end up with a Cessna and a Beechcraft Rating! - but with a few more hours to learn)

[HardCorePawn]

QUOTE (Kelburn @ Dec 17 2007, 09:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And for where I'll fly.
Dunno Welly Flight Centre (gotta love it as they don't do it for the money but to teach folks to fly) maybe with my dads friend (or both and that way I can end up with a Cessna and a Beechcraft Rating! - but with a few more hours to learn)

Not really... a type rating is (generally) a few hours of ground work and a few hours of flying... this is why a lot of people like to learn in a (cheaper) 152, and then get a type rating for the 172 when they've finished... save some coin and end up with the same result (except you also have a rating for the 152 )

As for you plans in general, my $0.10 worth (gotta keep up with inflation and the fact that we don't have 5c pieces anymore!), is that while I admire the fact that unlike half the 'yoof' of today (who just want to dress in black and cut themselves or be little wannabe 'gangsta's') you are actually thinking about your future, you want to be wary of developing such a detailed plan and possibly tunnel-vision... why?

1. You run the risk of being seriously disappointed and becoming discouraged if at any stage, you fail to meet one of your steps... ever seen what happens to sports people when they pick up a career ending injury at a very early time?

2. You run the risk of missing opportunities if you are too focused on your plan. If your plan is already mapped out as PPL CPL 2-3 years at Vincent 2-3 years RHS at Air Nelson 2 or 3 years command at Air Nelson 3-5 years RHS 737 737 command, and right around the time you're looking at going to the 737 there are opportunities on A380 at Singapore or 777's at Emirates you may miss out because you're not looking...

3. Aviation is a very dynamic industry... things can change very very quickly... if you've got your blinkers on and are not paying attention to the bigger picture, you will get left behind.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, by all means set some goals, but be fluid about how you are going to achieve them...

[benwynn]

Kelburn,

like everybody else has said just fly! Because of the Pilot Shortage we are in now, anything could happen. Apparently CASA is getting a new licence enabling CPL holders straight into the Right seat of a Jet. More Airlines will have cadetships in a few years, and start reducing there minimum flying hours. Then, you can sneek in the back door onto a 777