A resurected topic Outerra vs Prepar3d/FSX

A place to converse about the general aspects of flight simulation in New Zealand

Postby Kelvinr » Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:04 pm

Lockheed Martin's Prepar3d versus Outerra real time planet rendering project.

The screenshot of Prepar3d uses ORBX NZSI including 10 metre terrain elevation mesh with REX textures and OpusFSX weather engine.

Outerra is stock standard in Alpha. The only thing I have adjusted using internal setting is exposure of the sun and Field Of View to a more realistic level based on my experience flying and how far terrain, water etc... appears. also it uses standard SRTM 90 metre elevation mesh (all 11GB of it)

Make of this what you will but absolute potential for Outerra to be a future platform for a Flight Simulator among other things.

Hopefully this will raise some hope that there will be positive things to come relating to the Flight Simulator Genre.



Cheers,

Kelvin
Last edited by Kelvinr on Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ian Warren » Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:24 pm

Looking at the bottom screen looks more realistic at ALT but how dose it measure downstairs , i have noticed many design groups now building around Lockheed Martin's Prepar3d but nothing from the Outerra camp .
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Postby Kelvinr » Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:44 pm

Ian Warren wrote:
QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Jan 12 2013,4:24 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Looking at the bottom screen looks more realistic at ALT but how dose it measure downstairs , i have noticed many design groups now building around Lockheed Martin's Prepar3d but nothing from the Outerra camp .


This is "downstairs" at ground level still facing north from Milford Sound area. The grass even moves. I came across this downed Apache as well tongue.gif

Also note that this is a "build from ground up" project nothing copied from nobody except probably algorithms but they would be procedures not actual code.

http://i1.minus.com/ibcSyjQ96LQpjg.jpg
Last edited by Kelvinr on Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Ian Warren » Sat Jan 12, 2013 3:51 pm

Bloody Indians .. they all over the place .. now hey marn moving Grass .. seems police/law enforcement want to move it to laugh.gif
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Postby IslandBoy77 » Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:16 pm

Be good when Outerra moves out of Alpha into Beta. They've still got a lot of work to do, but reading thru the forum discussions it looks like they are working towards the final goal with great care & attention to detail Once the engine itself is finalised, it will be interesting to see who picks it up for the flight sim aspect. It's a good move by the developers to not specifically make Outerra anything more than a really detailed world / environment simulation system, then let others focus on the areas that interest them the most. Looks like we're at least another year away from Beta, though. sad.gif
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Postby Ian Warren » Sat Jan 12, 2013 8:34 pm

IslandBoy77 wrote:
QUOTE (IslandBoy77 @ Jan 12 2013,7:16 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Looks like we're at least another year away from Beta, though. sad.gif

Dose'nt matter what platform you design for .. still requires the hard yard and background work .. least with some of us you can see the work build piece by piece ..albeit being FSX cool.gif
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Postby Yob » Sun Jan 13, 2013 3:30 pm

Well when that is out i may give it a try but as of yet i am about to buy P3d version 1.4 and try that.
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Postby Kelvinr » Wed Jan 16, 2013 10:54 am

Here's another screenshot comparison of Dusky Sounds NZ. 5am in Summer.

http://www.outerra.com/forum/index.php?act...ttach=857;image
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Postby IslandBoy77 » Wed Jan 16, 2013 12:46 pm

One thing that really stands out as looking good in Outerra is both the atmospherics (light scattering etc) and the land / sea boundary. Those 2 things, amongst others, certainly reinforce or break the feel of "realism" in a sim, and those 2 things in particular have always annoyed me with FSX as being quite lacking.
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Postby Ian Warren » Wed Jan 16, 2013 1:32 pm

IslandBoy77 wrote:
QUOTE (IslandBoy77 @ Jan 16 2013,1:46 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
One thing that really stands out as looking good in Outerra is both the atmospherics (light scattering etc) and the land / sea boundary

I noticed that to , but how dose it go when loose that alt and start tree hugging .. course what are the cities like ! .
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Postby IslandBoy77 » Wed Jan 16, 2013 5:00 pm

I haven't downloaded the Outerra demo yet to have a lash: just too busy, plus they are still having issues with their graphics driver working with modern AMD HD-series video cards (like mine). But the videos (in hi def) that I've seen posted are excellent (given the Alpha state of Outerra). In fact even in Alpha, the atmospherics & sea boundaries are still quite away ahead of most simulators I've seen (whether they be flight or otherwise). The dusk and dawn of Outerra are particularly good: no stars appearing where they shouldn't and such. Indeed, one of the videos I saw of a very late twilight was very realistic. And since everything is rendered procedurally, one doesn't get that awful pixelation up close like on FSX - that alone is a huge step forward in simulation. I don't know HOW close one can get before some pixelation occurs, but "standing" on the beach or in the grass and viewing the scenery looks pretty detailed and un-pixelated. The recent addition of moving grass (in the wind, Ian, not by itself... winkyy.gif ) is a nice effect too.

It's safe to say that Outerra is a very long "work in progress", which I find exceptionally frustrating. The team of guys working on Outerra is very small, and it sounds like none of them are full-time on the project. They seriously need a financial backer: if I had the dosh, I certainly would, as I can see the depth of the work they are putting into the fundamentals.

It's fair to say that anyone wanting to have a go at creating a complete earth-like simulation framework has really got their work cut out for them, seeing as how even simulating the major "basic" mechanisms of planet earth is a major undertaking. Reading the post that Kelvin linked to and others (since I keep an eye on development and check the site every 4 weeks or so to see what's new), it's clear that they are carefully thinking through the "basics" like landclass rendering (since theirs will be done fractally, unlike like FSX), rivers / lakes & general water types, vegetation and "weather" (which of course encompasses things like clouds, rain, snow etc).

I've often hankered for a simulation engine that will at least bring "deformable" terrain into play, especially for battle situations (but would be good also if one manages to crash in an aircraft - be interesting to have the objects interact with each other as they would in real life, to a degree). It might be nice to be able to sit behind a brick wall and be impervious to tank or rocket fire as the sim can't "deform" the wall, but it's far from realistic. And when the shoe's on the other foot, it's damn annoying! laugh.gif

Perhaps what's really needed is for a group of simulation programmer geek-types to get together with the guys from Outerra, plan out whose going to work on what, then parcel it out so that the work can be completed more quickly. Then once the component code for each of the "modules" is complete, they can be pulled together and integrated. Still a h*ll of a big job, but "more hands make light work".
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