RNZAF "What if"

[Naki]

In reply to Marty's post here


My "what if" ...not OTT ...and thinking back (ie Skyhawks replaced in the early 90s by F-16s) and then forward

12/3 F-16/C/D (replaced Skyhawks in the 90s - replace by JAS-39Es in 2025)
12 Hawk-100 (instead of MB-339)
6 P-3C (replaced P-3Bs in the mid 90s - replaced by 4 -5 P-8s in 2025)
5 C-130H (replaced by 5-6 A400Ms (maybe some tanker versions) in 2020 when design proven)
5 C-295
4 C-295MP
10 NH-90s
10 A-109LUHs
18 T-6C Texan II
4 King Air 200 (leased)
1 A319CJ (leased - manned & maintained by Air NZ)

Navy
10 Super Lynx (instead of Seasprites) (3 Frigates , 3 OPVs)

[Ian Warren]

Paul , now that is a list I like , going into summer feeling we have a real armed force or lease a show off strength , little like us in the 1960/70/80s rather the scabs off the Pacific we have today

[Charl]

$$$... in Auckland we're still trying to figure out how the rest of the country is going to pay for Len Brown's downtown trainset
Don't the latest gen of turboprop trainers allow transition straight into fast jets? You wouldn't need Hawks then maybe.

Back to reality:
What was the deal with the Seasprites? Did I read correctly that we sold some to Peru, then bought some more from Oz?

[Naki]

Yes the current 5 Seasprites have been traded back to Kaman who have onsold them to Perus for I presume part payment for the 8 new ex Aussie ones (which they rejected)

Yes I understand the new turbprops can but that is probably more the higher performing PC-21 and Super Tucano and only the Swiss are doing (and I think Brazil and Chile on the Super Tucano) it but I understand that they having some transition issues (not sure)...I note that other countries that have bought PC-21s (ie Singapore, Saudia Arabia) for training all have fast jet trainers....moving forward with my Air Force fleet I would also delete the Hawk and farm out fast jet training to the NFTC in Canada and/or the RAAF as I don't think 1 squadron of F-16s can justify a fleet of fast jet trainers in support, especially if the air force fleet now include turboprop trainers

[Ian Warren]

Its funny the 'What ifs' .. biggest thing pointed out many times is the infrastructure required .... big red button .. BUZZZZ ... we lost most all the techies and engineers ground staff all due to the ONE .

Funny when you read RNZAF history and follow it through till that sad date, the build up and sorta a pride, it was not the biggest, but least we showed we were trying and achieving , the Skyhawks still flying are known as the best ever , a private company now owned the few flying .. why could not the NZDF follow a lead and use them in the same way making moneys on the side and still keep an air force, No Brainer .. but politicians have no brains ..

As for train sets , one thing we can pride ourselves on here in Christchurch, we have a super public transport system, Len Brown , maybe he should run for mayor of the East coast Bay of Plenty region .. they could really do with one there. ..

Edit: a train set i mean

[Splitpin]

Naki ..... Im thinking .... but i like what i see well thought out , reality it may not be , but its fun , and that sure seems to be lacking at the moment. (world wide)

[Ian Warren]

I do like the idea of buying the SAAB's, idea with the previous Draken and Viggen was easy infield fix by Sweden's military conscripts so that may help for the beginning rebuilding an air force.

[cezeta]

At this moment...What assets have the RNZAF to guarantee the sovereign of the NZ airspace?

With the chinese imperialism...Surely that Australia and New Zealand should strength his armed forces (Navy and Air Force at least) in order to build a credible deterrence.

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (cezeta @ Nov 29 2014,1:00 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

At this moment...What assets have the RNZAF to guarantee the sovereign of the NZ airspace?

Our first and current strike force are the CT4E airtrainers and flour bombs and rotten eggs

[cezeta]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Nov 29 2014,5:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Our first and current strike force are the CT4E airtrainers and flour bombs and rotten eggs

OMG!!! Maybe today is a good day for start to learn chinese.

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (cezeta @ Dec 1 2014,4:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OMG!!! Maybe today is a good day for start to learn chinese.

Well I eat plenty off it - love my Chinese food, I in almost what you call China town of Christchurch ... don't think its the Chinese we have to worry about.

[Splitpin]

cezeta , we (NZ) face more threat from economic attack , as in foreign vessels stealing our fish and other offshore resources .

With the plan Naki put forward , we would be able to hold our own for a while in the event of an all out invasion , but i doubt this would ever happen .

The emphasis should be on long range maritime surveillance , and the support and training to back it up.
And , as a major player in south pacific welfare , an equally capable long range transport component.

Regarding a strike force , I'm not sure. Being a maritime nation , i would tend to upgrade the navy with small to medium sized carriers (maybe 3) with appropriate aircraft .
Nice to do this type of thing , but in reality , i believe the days of a standalone NZ are well gone (Militarily) at least.
We tend to do what we are told to do , but like to think we were asked , by the powers that be.

It would be interesting to see just how we would react to a proposal by China , to build a fully funded joint venture Naval base somewhere in NZ .

I'm sure we would receive other offers worth consideration very quickly