Skyhawks - a change of heart?

[Adamski]

http://www.3news.co.nz/News/Associate-Defe...ArticleID=88024

The MP who once said the Air Force's decommissioned fighter jets were in poor condition and unlikely to be sold has had a change of heart.

ACT Deputy Leader Heather Roy made those comments while in opposition. But now, as part of government, she says the planes are in good nick.

Associate Defence Minister Heather Roy was always the first to criticise the former government over the Air Force's parked-up A4 Skyhawks. Last year she said the latex covers which protected them had failed - causing corrosion and that the avionics may even be affected. But now that she is in government she is seeing things a little differently.

Roy said “Looking inside they've pointed out where the corrosion is and I have to say you have to look pretty hard to find it. So it’s encouraging and it seems that the latex has been doing it's job.â€￾

The Skyhawks have been out of operation since 2002 following the then Labour government's decision to do away with the aging fighter-bomber fleet.

They can't be sold without the permission of the United States from where they were originally purchased and that has proved a difficult process.

But last year Labour said negotiations were under way with a possible buyer - believed to be a US-based air training school - which would buy both the 17 Skyhawks and 17 Aermacchi training jets - for $110 million.

While in opposition Heather Roy said that sale would never happen. But now she says negotiations are continuing and that another buyer is also interested.

Roy said “The optimal outcome for NZ is that a sale would proceed and proceed very quickly. If that's not going to happen we need to look at a plan B.â€￾

Plan B is that the Skyhawks are sold to collectors for far less than $110 million.

In any case, Roy hopes to have them sold by the end of the year.

[Peppermint]

I still don't see why any military asset being sold has to be given the go ahead by the US, afterall they don't own them, we should be able to sell them to whoever we like. I can see it from the view of 'arming a nation with deadly weapons' but come on, most if not all nations on the earth have 'deadly weapons'. Besides, any nation with a big military isn't going to necessarily want some old skyhawks to do battle with, especially against some of the more modern fighters and anti air systems.

In any case, if they're sold to private collectors, I just hope 1 or 2 stay here in NZ.

[Trev]

QUOTE (Peppermint @ Jan 22 2009, 09:29 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I still don't see why any military asset being sold has to be given the go ahead by the US, afterall they don't own them, we should be able to sell them to whoever we like. I can see it from the view of 'arming a nation with deadly weapons' but come on, most if not all nations on the earth have 'deadly weapons'. Besides, any nation with a big military isn't going to necessarily want some old skyhawks to do battle with, especially against some of the more modern fighters and anti air systems.

In any case, if they're sold to private collectors, I just hope 1 or 2 stay here in NZ.

The US state department only has to authorise the sale of american made products ie the Skyhawks and the APG-66 radar thats fitted into it. We had the same problem when we tried to dispose of the old NZ Army M113 armoured personell carriers. They had to sell them for scrap in the end because the US State dept wouldnt allow us to sell them to collectors or another military.

[Michael]

The US obviously doesn't really care about these things which is probably the difficult part. Its far more easier for them to just say "Scrap em" etc, than actually thinking about it.

If they do sell them for $110 million we're officially two thirds of the way to our own Eurofighter which would be perfectly suited to New Zealand ... But of cause our Navy Ships are ready to go in chase of any aircraft that feels like it wants to fly at a building.

And adding onto what Trev said, it would've been in the contract when we bought em.

[Ian Warren]

No point saying anything other than , scrap em , the nose off one TA4k .. to SeanG , I would be just happy with just a real mcCoy ejection seat , dont matter weather its from a Mac or A4 .. i've payed to have them sealed up , that seat ... my pc lazy boy ! thats my tax rebate .

[HercFeend]

QUOTE (Trev @ Jan 22 2009, 10:13 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The US state department only has to authorise the sale of american made products ie the Skyhawks and the APG-66 radar thats fitted into it. We had the same problem when we tried to dispose of the old NZ Army M113 armoured personell carriers. They had to sell them for scrap in the end because the US State dept wouldnt allow us to sell them to collectors or another military.

Well if that's the case maybe we should sell them to the Israelis, I can't imagine there would be any objects - after all that's where most US military hardware ends up...........

[Vegetableman]

QUOTE (Adamski @ Jan 22 2009, 08:48 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Roy said “Looking inside they've pointed out where the corrosion is and I have to say you have to look pretty hard to find it. So it’s encouraging and it seems that the latex has been doing it's job.â€￾

Heh heh. Yes, as long as it's hard to spot it's fine.
Someone obviously forgot to tell her corrosion on an aircraft is not like a car. She probably found it hard to find because she was looking for spots of rust around the windscreen.
I know for a fact that the latex came off over winter and plenty of water leaked into the cockpits damaging the avionics.

Change the party and same result. A politician full of it.

[SUBS17]

QUOTE (Trev @ Jan 27 2009, 09:13 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The US state department only has to authorise the sale of american made products ie the Skyhawks and the APG-66 radar thats fitted into it. We had the same problem when we tried to dispose of the old NZ Army M113 armoured personell carriers. They had to sell them for scrap in the end because the US State dept wouldnt allow us to sell them to collectors or another military.

Theres a few M113s owned by collectors in NZ I saw one just a few months ago.

QUOTE (HercFeend @ Jan 27 2009, 07:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well if that's the case maybe we should sell them to the Israelis, I can't imagine there would be any objects - after all that's where most US military hardware ends up...........

Israel still uses A4s and F4s I don't think they throw anything away.

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Jan 27 2009, 01:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No point saying anything other than , scrap em , the nose off one TA4k .. to SeanG , I would be just happy with just a real mcCoy ejection seat , dont matter weather its from a Mac or A4 .. i've payed to have them sealed up , that seat ... my pc lazy boy ! thats my tax rebate .

You can have the seat I'll take the whole pit, ok I'll settle for a HOTAS.

[steelsporran]

Typical politician and reported by a typical media that didn't challenge her over her U-turn.

[markll]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Jan 23 2009, 02:34 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

No point saying anything other than , scrap em , the nose off one TA4k .. to SeanG , I would be just happy with just a real mcCoy ejection seat , dont matter weather its from a Mac or A4 .. i've payed to have them sealed up , that seat ... my pc lazy boy ! thats my tax rebate .

Ian, you're going to have to fight my son for that seat!



Mark

[Adamski]

QUOTE (steelsporran @ Jan 23 2009, 01:43 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Typical politician and reported by a typical media that didn't challenge her over her U-turn.

Pathetic, isn't it? I can understand a U-turn based on new information (ie. some new customers) but how the Skyhawks "magically" impoved their condition should have been challenged. We get what we deserve, and when the media allow politicians to make it up as they go, renege on election promises etc. then our democracy is that much the poorer. No point in having fancy Skyhawks to defend our democracy if it falls apart because our media is brain-dead.

[Alex]

From what I've heard they were never in 'bad nick'. And from the video interview with Heather Roy it sounds to me like she was grasping at straws to attack Labour last year.

Alex

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (markll @ Jan 23 2009, 04:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Ian, you're going to have to fight my son for that seat!

Now i see the size of the little guy and that,s my opposition , and my seat .... BRING IT ON ! .... ...... Yes ! ............. Dinner around Marks place you NZFF guys , pot luck ......

[markll]

QUOTE (Ian Warren @ Jan 23 2009, 06:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Now i see the size of the little guy and that,s my opposition , and my seat .... BRING IT ON ! .... ...... Yes ! ............. Dinner around Marks place you NZFF guys , pot luck ......

Heh - trust me, he'd be up for the challenge! I've got a picture of him in a tank somewhere....

Mark

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (markll @ Jan 23 2009, 11:14 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Heh - trust me, he'd be up for the challenge! I've got a picture of him in a tank somewhere....

Mark

probally the same one i was pushing , i heard a young someone yelling ... Faster Faster ... shechhhhh

[K5054NZ]

*cough* NZFF syndicate-owned TA-4K......

[Ian Warren]

QUOTE (K5054NZ @ Jan 24 2009, 11:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

*cough* NZFF syndicate-owned TA-4K......

" cough , cough " or two , or maybe three , I just want my lazy boy ejector seat

[2fst4u]

i was just on a junior outdoor leadership course at RNZAF Dip Flat and whilst out in the bush, her and the commondant of ATC came and saw us. i didnt ask many questions about our defence force though because her son goes to my school. some of the skyhawks are in the 2nd hangar from the west at woodbourne. i think i saw three of them in there. whether this is maintainance or preparation to sell though, i am unsure.

[Vegetableman]

They've been there for quite some time (at least a year). I think it's simply because they have the room to put them there.
But they aren't being worked on at all.

[CDTDAN]

I thing F-15's would suit us just fine... or RAAF's old F/A-18A's when they get rid of them

(I want the HUD!!!)