A380 high density

[happytraveller]

Reading up on the net and saw this piece about an all-economy A380 that is on the way for Air Austral.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/...0s-in-2014.html

I cannot say that I fancy the idea of being onboard with 839 other souls and from what I read, then even higher densities may be on the way it can be certified to carry more than 853 passengers.

Smooth landings

[greaneyr]

QUOTE (happytraveller @ Sep 1 2009, 10:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Reading up on the net and saw this piece about an all-economy A380 that is on the way for Air Austral.

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/2009/...0s-in-2014.html

I cannot say that I fancy the idea of being onboard with 839 other souls and from what I read, then even higher densities may be on the way it can be certified to carry more than 853 passengers.

Smooth landings

It gets really scary when one starts to consider the implications of a hull loss of an aircraft carrying so many people. Just imagine if Tenerife happened with two fully-laden A380s.

[happytraveller]

Isn't there a saying in aviation,

"if it can go wrong, then it will, and at the worst possible time"

smooth landings.

[cowpatz]

This is the natural progression for the A380. The current configurations are just to attract passengers and have them accept the aircraft type. The economics of the current configurations just don't stack up...too much wasted real estate.
In order to make these aircraft pay their way you will see the likes of the showers removed (Singapore is already doing this) and extra seating put in. The advantage here is that seat/mile costs are reduced and the same overall yield can be achieved yet at lower fares.
Operators must be really suffering with this aircraft type. Emirates dispatch reliability with it is around 65% (sure it is a new type but it should be up on this by now). Qantas are bleeding with it. They are having to carry heaps of extra gas to cover the LAX to SYD depressurisation case. This is because the only pairings they can use are LAX /HNL and HNL/ SYD. This is because the likes of Faleolo and Nadi are unable to accommodate that size of aircraft) and means they have to carry extra gas to cover a decompression from halfway between HNL and SYD (west bound) and then fly at 14000 and 10000 ft until reaching either HNL or SYD. I have heard that they are carrying an extra 40 tonne over the 747 but that is unverified. It would not surprise me to see some of these aircraft parked up before long (under consideration by Virgin Atlantic). Emirates routinely arrive from SYD with less than 100 pax on board. Best I heard was 46 pax. Most airlines will put up with this until the type training requirements are met and then they will revisit the economics of the operation. Removal of the showers and increased seating is an indication that this is now underway. This is nothing new as we have seen this before in the industry. The 747 was marketed in the same way as the A380....a veritable flying hotel. The DC10 also had a first class lounge complete with swivel chairs and coffee tables. All marketing hype and as the world is run by accountants doomed to fail.
What we need is a 747 with an A380 style wing with derated Trent engines....now that would be a real winner.

[AlisterC]

Just think of it this way, with everyone on one plane, there is now less chance of two 747s with 400 passengers each crashing into each other

[Naki]

Ouch..I see some tough times ahead for Airbus and those operating it...although the 747 was in the same boat in the early 70s. I guess time will tell if the A380 is a succesful as the 747.

It will also be interesting to see if Airbus (if/when traffic growth allows) will eventually launch a stretched A380..the A380 seems to have been built with a stretch in mind...maybe then the A380 will show its true potential.

You can fully understand why Air NZ went the 777-300 route.

Also makes you wonder how Emirates is making a profit??? (or are they??)

Whats your view on the 747-8? Boeing seems to struggling to sell the passenger verision.

[cowpatz]

Not sure about the pax version but the freighter is coming along well.

[Ian Warren]

going to be a while before we see a 747 800 i guess , and dough ANZ will even look at them but its good to see 74's still getting built !

[AlisterC]

I wouldn't know, as I don't buy their fleets, but I reckon buying the A380 for Singapore and Emirates is all for the image. Especially Emirates.
The world would prefer to go twin jet these days. When was the last time you heard of Airbus announcing a major new customer for the A380? I don't want to see them go broke, but they probably need a miracle to break even.

[shotgun]

We could fix all the world's problems if we just breed a Boeing and an Airbus together.

Outcome= Boebus?
LOL

[2fst4u]

QUOTE (shotgun @ Sep 4 2009, 09:55 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We could fix all the world's problems if we just breed a Boeing and an Airbus together.

Outcome= Boebus?
LOL

i was thinking air-ing (ear-ring)

[ardypilot]

QUOTE (cowpatz @ Sep 2 2009, 08:59 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Emirates routinely arrive from SYD with less than 100 pax on board. Best I heard was 46 pax. Most airlines will put up with this until the type training requirements are met and then they will revisit the economics of the operation.

I've heard EK justify passenger numbers like this as the AU-NZ flights primary revenue generator is freight cargo?

[benwynn]

Yeah, thats what I heard too. Sure, they probably don't make that much money, but I would assume it's better use than having them sit around at Australian Airports all day.